ups by no way would I say youre the bad guy but like most things in life there is more than one application for something. atf is used in more things than you may realize. and with the cannondale being unique having seperate fluids we are not bound by conventional process. Take my yfz450 shares the fluid in the engine and trans so stuck using an oil that will provide for both. motorcycle oils have additives for the wet clutch so the discs dont burn up like if you used a straight synthetic oil for cars. gear lube when used in 1-wheel wonder rear ends fine out of the bottle but when used in posi-traction rear end needs additive for the clutch pack. maybe everything I know about auto will not carry over and I could go on for hours about the fluids and places they get used now days since they have evloved.
long story short if nobody ever pushed the envelope the performance gains we all see would never have been discovered and if atf will give me a little more edge with out too much risk I'm in.
but first I need to ride more so I have a need to even change the fluids
tranny fluid
QUOTE (UpsMan @ Sep 2 2009, 05:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Maybe i'm wrong. After reading several owners manuals I have lying around for various machines, it seems like just about any slippery fluid you feel like putting in there will work. If you have some atf lying around, hey, why not. The cannondale manual only states "SAE 80w or 85w" and thats all it says. What that means, I have no idea. gear lube? I guess. My honda says 10w 40 classification SG or higher, 4 stroke oil or equivalent motor oil.....
Brad from Blackwidow said he has been using
synthetic ATF .Automatic transmissions have clutches in them .
It seems like these oil discussions can really generate some opinions.
QUOTE (gml1998 @ Sep 2 2009, 04:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Brad from Blackwidow said he has been using
synthetic ATF .Automatic transmissions have clutches in them .
It seems like these oil discussions can really generate some opinions.
synthetic ATF .Automatic transmissions have clutches in them .
It seems like these oil discussions can really generate some opinions.
UGH, went to Kragen and bought some Lucas Oil then noticed on the way home that it said it was great in hypoid applications even though I thought it was a non hypoid oil. Called the company, asked if it was a hypoid oil or just good enough to be used in those applications and they put me on hold. The guy came back and asked "what are hypoid gears exactly?". Confidence lost, how does the person answering that question not know what hypoid is when its right on the dang bottle?
Went to Walmart (hate Walmart) and my stupidly small Walmart doesnt have motorcycle oil. Grrr
Went to Napa, they had Redline but it was only the heavy weight stuff. Finally found some Royal Purple 20-50 for ATV's. Guess thats what I am using.
That should work wonderful, as long as it is for atv's with manual clutches. LOL. Seriously though, ATF in our trannies? What kind, exactly? The reason must be because it works and is cheaper than oil? OR does it work better or something? I run the same oil in the engine and trans just for simplicity. I would rather use something cheaper than $9 per quart amsoil. Honda tranny oil for two-strokes would be my first choice, but my local honda dealer doesn't stock it and charges a special order fee to order it, and thats not going to happen.
Here why I use Transynd(allison's own brand)
1 extreme cold weather pumpabilty (our tranny has an oil pump and squirting jets for the spray bar and timing chain)
2 Specifically made for wet clutch transmisions (automatics has wet clutches just like ours)
3 high boiling point
4 easier shifting than any heavy gear oil
5 very slick and that means that just an extra edge in power
Even after Timbomooses drag race training sessions from countless 3rd and 4th gear starts my moto is still on the original clutch pack. I dont even rotate the plates anymore. No more clutch wear or tranny wear and very little metal on the filter during oil changes is why I switched . We have been using transynd in our fleet of vehicles and trucks since 2000 and guess how many tranny failures we have seen since .........ZERO . We were used to replacing trannies at least one every three months. That stuff is expensive but worth every penny .
ATF in manual trannies has been around for 25 years.
1 extreme cold weather pumpabilty (our tranny has an oil pump and squirting jets for the spray bar and timing chain)
2 Specifically made for wet clutch transmisions (automatics has wet clutches just like ours)
3 high boiling point
4 easier shifting than any heavy gear oil
5 very slick and that means that just an extra edge in power
Even after Timbomooses drag race training sessions from countless 3rd and 4th gear starts my moto is still on the original clutch pack. I dont even rotate the plates anymore. No more clutch wear or tranny wear and very little metal on the filter during oil changes is why I switched . We have been using transynd in our fleet of vehicles and trucks since 2000 and guess how many tranny failures we have seen since .........ZERO . We were used to replacing trannies at least one every three months. That stuff is expensive but worth every penny .
ATF in manual trannies has been around for 25 years.
QUOTE (UpsMan @ Sep 2 2009, 06:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why not just piss in the tranny?
I think the boiling point would be too low, kind of like UPSMan's!! Might be cool though- everyone would call it the whizz mobile because of how it smells when it goes by! You could even point the side cover vent hose up into the air and people would think you were purging the NOS.
Wistech's using the fancy transcend because he gets it for free- brings home a water bottle full every day! Seriously, though- sounds like some good stuff. There probably isn't anything that gets loaded like Allison tranny's. What would you estimate the viscosity to be?
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Canniboomer
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Hmmn, how many trannies have tiny needle bearings spinning at 10000 rpm? I've seen too many motors with dull-worn and grooved headshafts, and rusting inside. On the affected motors that I have personally drained and dropped, they have had rather thin oil being used.....but no clue as to what was in them.
I should mention the RedLine Lightweight Shockproof Gear Oil (smurf blood) for these reasons:
- Proven by now to pump just great in our motors,.... no doubt it gets literally everywhere.
- Clings to gears and upper components,...so it is there for the next start-up.
- Dampened gear noise.
- Does not sheet off components so readily, to expose the guts to rusting -- you can remove a sidecover after many months of the motor sitting idle, and still find it protecting.
- Unique color, for quick detection of possible intermixing with sump oil.
- Claimed to pump per a 30weight (I believe it by now),... but rated for 75-140wt
- Pure 100% ester synthetic base stock,...super slick
- No burning smell to drained oil, and no discernable wear, or rust, that you would attribute to the oil.
- Long change interval...every 2nd or 3rd sump change is probably enough.
But on the downside, they jacked the retail price up to $12.95/quart by now. I buy it by the case, and sometimes add to a customer order for $11....not cheap.
I should mention the RedLine Lightweight Shockproof Gear Oil (smurf blood) for these reasons:
- Proven by now to pump just great in our motors,.... no doubt it gets literally everywhere.
- Clings to gears and upper components,...so it is there for the next start-up.
- Dampened gear noise.
- Does not sheet off components so readily, to expose the guts to rusting -- you can remove a sidecover after many months of the motor sitting idle, and still find it protecting.
- Unique color, for quick detection of possible intermixing with sump oil.
- Claimed to pump per a 30weight (I believe it by now),... but rated for 75-140wt
- Pure 100% ester synthetic base stock,...super slick
- No burning smell to drained oil, and no discernable wear, or rust, that you would attribute to the oil.
- Long change interval...every 2nd or 3rd sump change is probably enough.
But on the downside, they jacked the retail price up to $12.95/quart by now. I buy it by the case, and sometimes add to a customer order for $11....not cheap.
QUOTE (Canniboomer @ Sep 3 2009, 02:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I should mention the RedLine Lightweight Shockproof Gear Oil (smurf blood) for these reasons:
But on the downside, they jacked the retail price up to $12.95/quart by now. I buy it by the case, and sometimes add to a customer order for $11....not cheap.
But on the downside, they jacked the retail price up to $12.95/quart by now. I buy it by the case, and sometimes add to a customer order for $11....not cheap.
I 2nd Redline. But I use the Superlight generally- ATF viscosity with 75W90 protection. 90 wt warm exceeds requirements of OEM. Good stuff for protection. I'm not saying its the best, but it's what I use and I don't have any reason to try anything else. Like Boomer said, if you need to work under a sidecover, you better have an extra can of brake cleaner because everything will be completely coated, even after sitting for months. Yep, it's a little pricey, but 2 qts is good for 3 oil changes, so it's relatively cheap.
And, if I'd known you carried it Dave, I'd much rather give you the $ than Summit!