Need more Octane

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Speed 1B · #1 Post by **Speed 1B** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 4:13 am

Well my 505 broke the dyno record this week coming in at 64 hp and 40ft/lbs after changing a few things. Mainly the compression and exhaust cam. Compression is now almost 16:1 and im using wistechs exhaust cam.

But, we stopped tuning early before we tweaked all the power out of it due to what we think was detonation. We still had more room to tune it on the 110 before we switched to oxygenated fuel and were hoping to make 65 before switching over...would have been close.

So, i need to run some different fuel. I can run any of the VP fuels. I can also get the Klotz, and it is priced really reasonable. I can also run Turbo Blue Advange. These are the easiest fuels for me to get.

I dont know if anyone has any expierience in the high compression fuel area but just looking for opinions.

We are gonna tear the motor back down this week and check it for damage, then its back to the dyno. 64 hp with the wrong fuel in it is encouraging.

peterock · #2 Post by **peterock** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 4:35 am

I have timbo's 14.5:1 in mine and been using the Klotz 113 Oxy with Coxoc additive. Haven't dynoed it yet but haven't had any predetonation problems. Klotz, VP, and Sunoco are probably going to be your best options. I would only go with the sealed cans and stay away from anything on the gas pumps. Never know how long that stuff has been in there. I know the stations that usually carry the race gas at the pumps can usually order different fuels in the cans for you as well.

Come to crandon and I'll give you a couple gallons of the Klotz 113 I have.

Happyboy · #3 Post by **Happyboy** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 4:40 am

what record did you break? not the highest hp....the highest hp natural aspired sure.

Anyone ever gonna bone up and come after me or what?

Gratz Speed1b... i'll make room up here for yah.

Speed 1B · #4 Post by **Speed 1B** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:37 am

Happyboy 70 hp on nitrous isnt that impressive to me. Once we get mine tuned in i doubt its far off that. With the nitrous you should be able to make high 80s low 90s hp. Im just basing this on the yfzs/hondas running similar set-ups.

Why spend the money and time for around 5 extra horsepower? If your gonna do it build a real motor and put a real shot to it.

Id put my poor pathetic 64hp against ur nitrous motor anyday.

Speed 1B · #5 Post by **Speed 1B** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 12:46 pm

Pete im looking at the 118 Klotz. Im going to use the nitro additive after talking to klotz
tech last week. He said that the coxoc is less potent so it will pass fuel tests and the
nitro will make more power.Its also alot cheaper.

Im going to look into the fuel that the NHRA prostock bikes are running too. Its for super high compression. Its a VP fuel, but it probably costs a fortune.

Thanks for the help Pete.

wistech · #6 Post by **wistech** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 2:23 pm

Interesting thought. If you need to buy $25+ a gallon fuel just to run extreme compresion nitrous is actually cheaper and since its not stressing the engine all the time like compresion the engine might even last longer. Either way both engine are grenades with very short lifespans. Better think about setting up a spare or two to finish a season.
Just to put it into perspective we have got stock engine to 57 and a 450 to 59hp. You need to go big bore stroker 505 with high compresion with special cams just to gain 5hp on these . Be thankfull for every 1/4 horse you get as every fraction of increase takes a monumental step in cost and developement. You have been lucky for quite a while that your last engine held up without issue and it had harldy any time on it. Once you get to the extremes prepare yourself for rewards and also the failures/problems which are guaranteed to happen .

J. Delaney · #7 Post by **J. Delaney** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:32 pm

Have you considered running alky? At 16:1 you might be able to run diesel.

peterock · #8 Post by **peterock** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 4:03 pm

QUOTE (Speed 1B @ Jul 13 2008, 07:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Pete im looking at the 118 Klotz. Im going to use the nitro additive after talking to klotz
tech last week. He said that the coxoc is less potent so it will pass fuel tests and the
nitro will make more power.Its also alot cheaper.

Im going to look into the fuel that the NHRA prostock bikes are running too. Its for super high compression. Its a VP fuel, but it probably costs a fortune.

Thanks for the help Pete.

Just be carefull with the nitro additive as it will run hotter. I was thinking of trying the 105 octane E85 with the nitro additive (as Coxoc doesn't mix with ethanol). That would be for race day, but on practice days have a map for just E85. Not sure, just and idea. But for drags you shouldn't have a problem with heat buildup obviously so it shouldn't be an issue.

cannondale27 · #9 Post by **cannondale27** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 4:12 pm

With these really extreme builds I think Alcohol is way to go. Especially if you put Nitrous to it. Detonation is the killer of these motors and from what I understand the alcohol completely eliminates that even under high boost, nitrous or whatever you can think of. Benefits outweigh negatives at the levels of mods you are getting into.

ACEwrench · #10 Post by **ACEwrench** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 4:28 pm

should i be running a different fuel..im running a 14:1 compression motor i run on 100 octane race gas i can get from a pump. i dont have any detonation issues that im aware of, but dont want any either. i can get VP 110 or whatever..just wondering