Aftermarket Steering Stems
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CDaleRider
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- Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:41 pm
Steering Stems
Arens also makes a replacement stem for the CDale that lowers the tie rod plate and reduces bump steer. Also, it's cheaper than the others, and you know it will fit right because they make them for the factory.
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4strokemadman
- Posts: 0
- Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:41 pm
ATC250R,
Just a FYI, lowering the tie rod plate does reduce bump steer. You are partially correct in that if the plate is lowered too much you start to get toe out in the top/middle part of the stroke which is where you spend most of the time. This is bad and hurts stability big time. When looking at the '03 stem we really tried to reduce bump steer as much as we could without getting too much toe out in jounce. On the '02 a lot of people liked to run zero toe. With the '03 people will probobly find at least 1/8" toe in works better than zero toe. Lowering the tie rod plate also slightly increases the ackermann which helps it to turn in a little better.
You should know this JNINE we talked about it quite a few times
Just a FYI, lowering the tie rod plate does reduce bump steer. You are partially correct in that if the plate is lowered too much you start to get toe out in the top/middle part of the stroke which is where you spend most of the time. This is bad and hurts stability big time. When looking at the '03 stem we really tried to reduce bump steer as much as we could without getting too much toe out in jounce. On the '02 a lot of people liked to run zero toe. With the '03 people will probobly find at least 1/8" toe in works better than zero toe. Lowering the tie rod plate also slightly increases the ackermann which helps it to turn in a little better.
You should know this JNINE we talked about it quite a few times
Steering Stems
Hello again:
I like to run 1/8" toe in if possible. I think that helps keep the front end from wandering around a little bit. Maybe it's just an old habit. I'm not really sure if I agree with the ackerman steering effect for a quad. I know the car guys like to run that, but we're not talking cars or in most cases hard surfaces. I want both wheels to dig in hard and turn, and help me get around the corner, especially on a track with deep ruts in the corners, but I think this would apply to the sand as well. The ackerman setup will often want to take different tracks through the ruts, and the outside wheel will want to climb over the rut or berm.. Remember, with the ackerman steering effect the cars guys run they also have a steering ratio for amount of wheel turned to amount of steering wheel movement. That's OK with a steering wheel, but In ATVs we have a direct link to the steering components. I definitely want my bars to point me exactly where I want to go. In fact, this is one big reason the Dirt Wheels magazine guys didn't really care for the Polaris. The amount of bar movement was not equal to the amount of turn produced at the wheel. Bar movement was over exagerated and it didn't feel comfortable to them. By the way, I did check out a Polaris pretty thoroughly last weekend. I was really thinking it would be quite a bit better than it was. They've got brackets and tabs EVERYWHERE! No wonder it weighs 500 lbs! Also, I know they put a lot of time into the front end, but to tell you the truth I don't care for it, and it's got a LOT of rather heavy parts. It also has a **** of a lot of rod ends to replace. Controls were all comfortable, but the plastic layout had not just one or two odd cuts and areas that would be a problem, but LOTS of them in areas that you can't see from the photos. Weld & Fab quality was about the same as a 400EX, which in my opinion is pretty poor. I really was expecting better from a company that's been in the business for a while. From looking at it I really question who did the test riding. They certainly have a LONG way to go.
I like to run 1/8" toe in if possible. I think that helps keep the front end from wandering around a little bit. Maybe it's just an old habit. I'm not really sure if I agree with the ackerman steering effect for a quad. I know the car guys like to run that, but we're not talking cars or in most cases hard surfaces. I want both wheels to dig in hard and turn, and help me get around the corner, especially on a track with deep ruts in the corners, but I think this would apply to the sand as well. The ackerman setup will often want to take different tracks through the ruts, and the outside wheel will want to climb over the rut or berm.. Remember, with the ackerman steering effect the cars guys run they also have a steering ratio for amount of wheel turned to amount of steering wheel movement. That's OK with a steering wheel, but In ATVs we have a direct link to the steering components. I definitely want my bars to point me exactly where I want to go. In fact, this is one big reason the Dirt Wheels magazine guys didn't really care for the Polaris. The amount of bar movement was not equal to the amount of turn produced at the wheel. Bar movement was over exagerated and it didn't feel comfortable to them. By the way, I did check out a Polaris pretty thoroughly last weekend. I was really thinking it would be quite a bit better than it was. They've got brackets and tabs EVERYWHERE! No wonder it weighs 500 lbs! Also, I know they put a lot of time into the front end, but to tell you the truth I don't care for it, and it's got a LOT of rather heavy parts. It also has a **** of a lot of rod ends to replace. Controls were all comfortable, but the plastic layout had not just one or two odd cuts and areas that would be a problem, but LOTS of them in areas that you can't see from the photos. Weld & Fab quality was about the same as a 400EX, which in my opinion is pretty poor. I really was expecting better from a company that's been in the business for a while. From looking at it I really question who did the test riding. They certainly have a LONG way to go.
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4strokemadman
- Posts: 0
- Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:41 pm
Ackerman
I thought that was you! At first I thought, Boy this guy is bright and he thinks of everything!!! I was right!
As for the tire scrub, you are right, but do you think it makes much difference on dirt? That would be an interesting concept to test..... Or maybe you already have.....
I didn't get any email from you recently by the way.
JA
As for the tire scrub, you are right, but do you think it makes much difference on dirt? That would be an interesting concept to test..... Or maybe you already have.....
I didn't get any email from you recently by the way.
JA
D 14 Meeting
John,
Any idea when the D-14 meeting to set next years schedule is? Myself and a few of the CC riders would like to attend, to try to talk a few more owners into holding races.
Thanks, Mike
Any idea when the D-14 meeting to set next years schedule is? Myself and a few of the CC riders would like to attend, to try to talk a few more owners into holding races.
Thanks, Mike
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moto-rider-7
- Posts: 0
- Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:41 pm
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Cannibal440
- Posts: 0
- Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:41 pm
Hey Guys, thanks for all the info. Now i'm wondering if all the aftermarket stems lower the tabs at the bottom of the stem. or if some are just stronger than the stock one? anyone know? I'm not gonna buy one cause "it looks really strong" or cause it's chrome, I really don't care about these things, I just want to make my quad handle better. Anyway thanks again for the feedback, It's good to know we have some really knowledgable people here.