08 Quad Graphics and specs

[peterock]

is it really worth my efforts to get one? Say I do, then I'm going to have to listen to Happyboy whine that it's not real, or you want several charts, or the chart must have been from a freek motor that put out unusually high numbers and isn't the average.

[jesshamner]

Ok. Nevermind.

[Happyboy]

My comments had nothing to even do with hp. It had to do with the "new map" comment. ATK keeps saying how they are doing stuff and they aren't. They have had great opportunities withi this brand and their bad business technics have squashed every chance they had.

Pete, you are not ATK. So why get soo defensive about them? There are problems with all quads, all vendors lie about something. Notice I didnt' say manufacturer? They aren't one. They simply rebadge things.

I as John Q public don't need to prove jack. Unless the people making the claim show proof then its BS plain and simple. Its this mentality that allows us to get sucked into people like Winky and others. Just because they say its good means nothing. I can say I am porting heads better than everyone else and you can't prove I don't. Unless of course you spend the money to buy my service and then test it. If a vendor isn't going to back up the claims then be prepared for speculation.

You want to know why I say they couldn't have made NEW maps? Money. To create a real NEW map it takes alot of dyno time, software, time, and money. And what would they get out of it? A new map, wow. It isn't worth the investment. Not making a new map isn't my beef. Its saying you made mapping changes. Thats complete BS and just goes to their character.

Now, since I reitterated my thoughts and said this had nothing to do with hp you can be happy I am done. There is no proving anything to you as you are still new to all this and blind to the problems of the past.

[peterock]

sure would be nice if the Admin team would clean up this post and keep it on track instead of letting one guy get on the soap box because he doesn't like ATK. Post was started as an informational post to show everyone what ATK had in-line for 08. If you disagree with something they are claiming, post it in the general forum please. If you have solid proof that something I'm posting is incorrect, provide me with solid evidence that it isn't correct and I will address it.

[wayneschofield]

Come on guys, I run my own dyno and my tired-out speed did 43bhp (flywheel) in stock trim with the cruddy old round can.

Cannibal with toaster made 46bhp (flywheel) after run-in and 43 when the cam started to lose the top off the ex-lobe (the loss of power is what made me decide to tear it down- I knew something was wrong).

My sons fresh YFZ made 38bhp (flywheel) on my dyno on the same day and my other son's mojave made 24bhp. So my dyno's not far off is it?

ATK now claim that their latest, further developed, better built, biger capacity motor makes 48bhp. Why would it not do? No reason, it no doubt does make the power claimed. That they MAY use a different kind of dyno that gives flywheel figures, rather than wheel figures that you use as your 'benchmark', is irrelevant.

Virtually the entire motor industry uses flywheel figures so why should ATK not do?

Honda wouldn't even say what their new 700 weighs in the last mag article I read about it, I didn't see anyone giving them a hard time over that, did I?

Some slack needs to be cut and double standards minimised I think.....

[cannondale27]

I agree well said.I look at it this way.Whether right or wrong that 48hp is not a crazy far off number.I tend to believe it.The history of ATK is the problem alot of people have.But as a group think of how little progress we would have made if we all had closed minds.Look at ATK's as a long term effort.A little progress here and there and maybe a step backward once in a while.We have all seen and done both personally and ATK.What matters most is they have proven to be in it for the long haul and are doing something to progress.That is way more than many who our group has dealt with.We cannot forget past but we always have to look forward.

[peterock]

Not sure if any of you have read the reviews on the new KTM quads? Quads that people have been talking about and how great they are going to be. I look at the 08 ATK and they are still ahead of the game. $9000 for the KTM and what do you get? Yes it is set up for woods racing, but a 3.5 gallon tank? Yep, that will get replaced. The shocks are old news as far as what ATK/Cannondale has been using. It's not fuel injected. No nerf bars. Only 11:1 piston. Plus, they are only making a limited amount so you can imagine the $9000 is going to turn into $10000 at the dealership.

So some of you can say ATK is overpriced and they need to catch up. But are they really overpriced (especially when the cost hasn't really changed since they were cannondale) and who do they need to play catch-up with?

Stock vs Stock, are there any motors out there that are pruducing more power?
ATK arguably has the best suspension over everyone.
nerf bars
choice of tires
etc.....

So who is really probably close........Suzuki. But how much money have the dumped into their Quad program in the last couple of years to get there? but you know what, the all out racer still needs to have the shocks redone all around.

Oh, and you can buy a complete race ready Kawi, but it's going to cost you in the neighborhood of $20g.

[jesshamner]

No way is Suzuki close to the ATK. Not in power, not in suspension, not in FI, and not in cool factor.

[UpsMan]

QUOTE (jesshamner @ Nov 7 2007, 07:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No way is Suzuki close to the ATK. Not in power, not in suspension, not in FI, and not in cool factor.

Definately not in the cool factor. Definately not.

[UpsMan]

Pete, have you uncovered any info on the Rekluse?