I know an engineer at work that is playing around with ceramic coating on pistons and heads as you can see if the pictures load. He has worked out a process that gets a pretty good even coating involving a vacuum chamber and what not. His idea is that if you keep the heat off the combustion surfaces it will produce more power and last longer.
So I could probably get this done for next to nothing on a motor that I have ready to assemble and definatly want to try it on a hmf pipe but this is as of now untested on motor parts as far as what he is doing. I have not done any research yet on this yet but I am sure that somebody else has tried it I would think.
So what are your thoughts!
Ray
Ceramic coating on pistons and heads
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thedeatons
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- Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:41 pm
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thedeatons
- Posts: 0
- Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 10:41 pm
Well I am just guessing that I could maybe have some parts done for next to nothing but you on the other hand would have to pay twice that!
I dunno I would have to talk with him about it, I sent him some questions. He is just like the rest of us... if he can subsidise his expensive habbits and help other people out then everybody wins! Wish I would have jumped on it when he was experimenting and working out his process, could have given him some parts to play with. I am just a little hesitant when it comes to intermal motor parts without much testing! Too thin and the effects are minimal and too much and hard pieces come off and eat things!
He says that the most time consuming part is the masking so if he does not have to do that then the costs would be reasonable.
Yes he is a yami guy and what he can do on two wheels at glamis would leave you slack jawed! He is the guy you see wheeling up, down and across the hill standing on the seat! Jumping into the deep whoops in fourth gear pinned, jumping from bowl to bowl... those kind of things!
Ray
I dunno I would have to talk with him about it, I sent him some questions. He is just like the rest of us... if he can subsidise his expensive habbits and help other people out then everybody wins! Wish I would have jumped on it when he was experimenting and working out his process, could have given him some parts to play with. I am just a little hesitant when it comes to intermal motor parts without much testing! Too thin and the effects are minimal and too much and hard pieces come off and eat things!
He says that the most time consuming part is the masking so if he does not have to do that then the costs would be reasonable.
Yes he is a yami guy and what he can do on two wheels at glamis would leave you slack jawed! He is the guy you see wheeling up, down and across the hill standing on the seat! Jumping into the deep whoops in fourth gear pinned, jumping from bowl to bowl... those kind of things!
Ray
If I remember correctly when I was getting prices from Swain Tech, it was around $110 to have the piston coated and the combustion chamber done, to include the exhaust track in the head.
DO NOT BE FOOLED BY THE COATING IMITATORS! Over the years imitators have come and gone while Swain Tech remains the industry leader in thermal barrier coatings, friction reducing coatings, lubricating coatings and other coatings to improve the performance of engine and exhaust parts. Though imitation is the greatest form of flattery, most of these companies give coatings a bad name. These companies are long on promises and short on performance. They offer simple commercially available coatings and apply these simple materials to parts being used in demanding high performance applications. Inevitably, these inferior coatings used by the other coating companies fail and the consumer will likely never
try coatings again because they think all coatings are the same. This is unfortunate because Swain Tech????????s coatings have been proven in all levels of racing and high mileage street applications for over 25 years. There have even been ???????do it yourself??????? kits sold, but those probably only appeal to those who thought the Flowbee was a good way to give yourself a ???????do it yourself??????? haircut or a can of spray paint is an intelligent way to paint a car.
DO NOT BE FOOLED BY THE COATING IMITATORS! Over the years imitators have come and gone while Swain Tech remains the industry leader in thermal barrier coatings, friction reducing coatings, lubricating coatings and other coatings to improve the performance of engine and exhaust parts. Though imitation is the greatest form of flattery, most of these companies give coatings a bad name. These companies are long on promises and short on performance. They offer simple commercially available coatings and apply these simple materials to parts being used in demanding high performance applications. Inevitably, these inferior coatings used by the other coating companies fail and the consumer will likely never
try coatings again because they think all coatings are the same. This is unfortunate because Swain Tech????????s coatings have been proven in all levels of racing and high mileage street applications for over 25 years. There have even been ???????do it yourself??????? kits sold, but those probably only appeal to those who thought the Flowbee was a good way to give yourself a ???????do it yourself??????? haircut or a can of spray paint is an intelligent way to paint a car.
hmm..this could lead into something possibly... keep us posted of course.. and for ur info.. id be one of thsoe crazy nuts doing crazy **** out there in the dunes....IF I HAD ANY NEAR ME!!...i soooo wanna hit the dunes up.. i know i know.. im deprived ...but ill make it there one of these days!!...but yea...back on track...keep us posted
I guess he is going at this as a side business.... he has been doing this alot longer then I knew about and is offering a coating on the piston skirt also.
His work is top notch and I can vouch for him doing a good job and like I said I work with him so no worries... his prices are more than reasonable.
Here is his ad... I dont stand by all of his claims here, I am just passing it along.
I asked about exhaust pipes and got this reply... "I don't have the equipment for large items like exhaust pipes. There are a bunch of people that have requested exhaust, but I can't offer anything more than just the simple spray and bake method on the exhaust."
He may be thinking the long standard exhaust so I may give him an example to try out.
What Ceramic coatings and Dry Film coatings provide:
??????? Increased horsepower and torque
??????? Increase economy
??????? Lower heat transfer
??????? Extended cylinder life
??????? Extended piston life
??????? Ability to run higher compression ratios
??????? Ability to run leaner fuel mixtures
How Ceramic coatings and Dry Film coatings work:
??????? Ceramic coatings provide a thermal barrier ???????insulation??????? reducing the transfer of heat to the part.
??????? Ceramic and dry films provide a barrier against corrosion from oxidation and corrosive chemicals.
??????? Ceramic coatings resist the formation of hot spots providing consistent combustion and reduces fatigue of critical parts.
??????? Ceramic coatings reduce pre-ignition ???????detonation???????, allowing for advanced timing curves.
??????? When the piston crown and head chamber are ceramic coated, the engine can withstand greater combustion temperatures without failure.
??????? Ceramic coatings reduce thermal expansion allowing for tighter piston to cylinder tolerances.
??????? The Molybdenum Bisulphite or ???????Moly??????? in the dry film is a natural lubricant and protects pistons from wear.
??????? Dry film coatings retain oil and provide extra lubrication to critical areas.
??????? Dry film coatings are sacrificial and will partially wear away instead of the piston wearing away, but the dry film molybdenum bonds well to the piston and is never completely removed, retaining its slick nature.
My process is tightly controlled. No other shop performs this level of attention.
??????? New gloves will always be worn when handling your part. This prevents residues from contaminating the surface that the coating will adhere to.
??????? Your part will be professionally cleaned before going into the blast cabinet so there is no contamination of the blast media, blast cabinet, or your part.
??????? The blast cabinet has been purchased solely for coating prep and unlike other shops, the cabinet has never been used for cleaning parts and has never had silica or glass bead inside the cabinet. Only the proper etching media is used and there is never a chance for cross-contamination.
??????? Your part will be professionally cleaned after removing from the blast cabinet.
??????? Your part will go through a proprietary process that removes cleaning solvents, non-volatile residues, and hydrocarbons from the pores of the metal.
??????? Your part will then go through a proprietary process to apply the coating of your choice to the part giving the coating the best bond possible.
When quality counts, there is only one option.
??????? Almost all other shops are dirty, don????????t used gloves, don????????t properly clean the parts, and use dirty or incorrect etching material.
??????? In addition, I have developed the process and equipment that NO-ONE else has that completely eliminates blistering, cracking, and creates a stronger bond with the metal.
Pricing:
Piston crown ceramic coating $25 each
Piston skirt Molybdenum dry-film coating $25 each
Both ceramic and dry-film coating $35 each
Single piston cylinder head ceramic coating (2-stroke combustion chamber only) $25
Multiple piston cylinder head ceramic coating (2-stroke combustion chamber only) call or email for quote
Single piston cylinder head ceramic coating (4-stroke combustion chamber and valve faces only) call or email for quote
Multiple piston cylinder head ceramic coating (4-stroke combustion chamber and valve faces only) call or email for quote
Note: Pistons and cylinder heads must be thoroughly cleaned and free of carbon deposits.
Additional charges may apply if parts are not cleaned. Wrist pins and rings must be removed from pistons. Rubber or plastic parts must be removed from piston and cylinder heads. Valves must be assorted in a valve organizer and properly numbered or left in the head with no springs or retainers.
Read further to find how it all started:
I am a mechanical and electrical engineer and have worked in the industry over the past 12 years providing electrical and mechanical engineering for an assortment of fields such as military aircraft, semiconductor fabrication, and space operations. My favorite hobby is motorcycles, and I always want the highest performance out of my motorcycles. A couple of years ago, I built an engine for a dirtbike with a compression ratio of 13.5:1 and ran off of race fuel. The bike ran and performed perfectly, but the high compression would occasionally lead to overheating. Last year I built another bike up identical to the first one and decided to try ceramic coatings on the piston and combustion chamber. I am always skeptical about new products and claims had my doubts on whether this would work or not. I gave my engine parts to a shop in Tucson that came highly recommended as the best in town. The piston and head were returned to me with tiny cracks in the ceramic and the head looked like the ceramic had blistered slightly in which the shop had removed and recoated the problem area with another coat of ceramic. These problems were minor, and I built the motor anyway. The result was that the overheating problem was eliminated. This worked so well in fact that with an adjustment of the ignition timing, I could reliably run the 13.5:1 compression ratio on pump fuel!
Since then, I was always concerned about how well the ceramic actually bonded to the piston and head. I knew I could make the process better, so I researched what I needed to do to apply coatings on my own. After purchasing my equipment and experimenting with coating parts, I found that it was extremely easy to have blisters and cracks in the coating. Apparently this is very common throughout the industry, and until now, the only way to control it was to have tight control on the application and heating process. I borrowed a concept from the semiconductor fabrication industry for my process and purchased some surplus lab equipment. The result was nothing short of spectacular. The coatings were completely free of blisters and cracks even if I purposely attempted to create blisters and cracks. I also found that the ceramic and dry films bonded much better with my new proprietary process.
I am now providing these coatings for pistons and small cylinder heads. The prices given barely cover the costs of the chemicals and materials, but I just want to get recognized for the quality piston coatings that I can provide over the competition. The equipment I am using is very expensive lab surplus equipment and limits the size of part that I can accommodate. If you have an unusual part, please email me with a picture and dimensions so I can give you a quote.
Please call (520)668-5264 after 5pm
I work as an engineer during the day, so please call after 5pm or leave a voicemail or email. Please leave your name, contact information, and the type of coating you are interested in.
Tom Hamilton
His work is top notch and I can vouch for him doing a good job and like I said I work with him so no worries... his prices are more than reasonable.
Here is his ad... I dont stand by all of his claims here, I am just passing it along.
I asked about exhaust pipes and got this reply... "I don't have the equipment for large items like exhaust pipes. There are a bunch of people that have requested exhaust, but I can't offer anything more than just the simple spray and bake method on the exhaust."
He may be thinking the long standard exhaust so I may give him an example to try out.
What Ceramic coatings and Dry Film coatings provide:
??????? Increased horsepower and torque
??????? Increase economy
??????? Lower heat transfer
??????? Extended cylinder life
??????? Extended piston life
??????? Ability to run higher compression ratios
??????? Ability to run leaner fuel mixtures
How Ceramic coatings and Dry Film coatings work:
??????? Ceramic coatings provide a thermal barrier ???????insulation??????? reducing the transfer of heat to the part.
??????? Ceramic and dry films provide a barrier against corrosion from oxidation and corrosive chemicals.
??????? Ceramic coatings resist the formation of hot spots providing consistent combustion and reduces fatigue of critical parts.
??????? Ceramic coatings reduce pre-ignition ???????detonation???????, allowing for advanced timing curves.
??????? When the piston crown and head chamber are ceramic coated, the engine can withstand greater combustion temperatures without failure.
??????? Ceramic coatings reduce thermal expansion allowing for tighter piston to cylinder tolerances.
??????? The Molybdenum Bisulphite or ???????Moly??????? in the dry film is a natural lubricant and protects pistons from wear.
??????? Dry film coatings retain oil and provide extra lubrication to critical areas.
??????? Dry film coatings are sacrificial and will partially wear away instead of the piston wearing away, but the dry film molybdenum bonds well to the piston and is never completely removed, retaining its slick nature.
My process is tightly controlled. No other shop performs this level of attention.
??????? New gloves will always be worn when handling your part. This prevents residues from contaminating the surface that the coating will adhere to.
??????? Your part will be professionally cleaned before going into the blast cabinet so there is no contamination of the blast media, blast cabinet, or your part.
??????? The blast cabinet has been purchased solely for coating prep and unlike other shops, the cabinet has never been used for cleaning parts and has never had silica or glass bead inside the cabinet. Only the proper etching media is used and there is never a chance for cross-contamination.
??????? Your part will be professionally cleaned after removing from the blast cabinet.
??????? Your part will go through a proprietary process that removes cleaning solvents, non-volatile residues, and hydrocarbons from the pores of the metal.
??????? Your part will then go through a proprietary process to apply the coating of your choice to the part giving the coating the best bond possible.
When quality counts, there is only one option.
??????? Almost all other shops are dirty, don????????t used gloves, don????????t properly clean the parts, and use dirty or incorrect etching material.
??????? In addition, I have developed the process and equipment that NO-ONE else has that completely eliminates blistering, cracking, and creates a stronger bond with the metal.
Pricing:
Piston crown ceramic coating $25 each
Piston skirt Molybdenum dry-film coating $25 each
Both ceramic and dry-film coating $35 each
Single piston cylinder head ceramic coating (2-stroke combustion chamber only) $25
Multiple piston cylinder head ceramic coating (2-stroke combustion chamber only) call or email for quote
Single piston cylinder head ceramic coating (4-stroke combustion chamber and valve faces only) call or email for quote
Multiple piston cylinder head ceramic coating (4-stroke combustion chamber and valve faces only) call or email for quote
Note: Pistons and cylinder heads must be thoroughly cleaned and free of carbon deposits.
Additional charges may apply if parts are not cleaned. Wrist pins and rings must be removed from pistons. Rubber or plastic parts must be removed from piston and cylinder heads. Valves must be assorted in a valve organizer and properly numbered or left in the head with no springs or retainers.
Read further to find how it all started:
I am a mechanical and electrical engineer and have worked in the industry over the past 12 years providing electrical and mechanical engineering for an assortment of fields such as military aircraft, semiconductor fabrication, and space operations. My favorite hobby is motorcycles, and I always want the highest performance out of my motorcycles. A couple of years ago, I built an engine for a dirtbike with a compression ratio of 13.5:1 and ran off of race fuel. The bike ran and performed perfectly, but the high compression would occasionally lead to overheating. Last year I built another bike up identical to the first one and decided to try ceramic coatings on the piston and combustion chamber. I am always skeptical about new products and claims had my doubts on whether this would work or not. I gave my engine parts to a shop in Tucson that came highly recommended as the best in town. The piston and head were returned to me with tiny cracks in the ceramic and the head looked like the ceramic had blistered slightly in which the shop had removed and recoated the problem area with another coat of ceramic. These problems were minor, and I built the motor anyway. The result was that the overheating problem was eliminated. This worked so well in fact that with an adjustment of the ignition timing, I could reliably run the 13.5:1 compression ratio on pump fuel!
Since then, I was always concerned about how well the ceramic actually bonded to the piston and head. I knew I could make the process better, so I researched what I needed to do to apply coatings on my own. After purchasing my equipment and experimenting with coating parts, I found that it was extremely easy to have blisters and cracks in the coating. Apparently this is very common throughout the industry, and until now, the only way to control it was to have tight control on the application and heating process. I borrowed a concept from the semiconductor fabrication industry for my process and purchased some surplus lab equipment. The result was nothing short of spectacular. The coatings were completely free of blisters and cracks even if I purposely attempted to create blisters and cracks. I also found that the ceramic and dry films bonded much better with my new proprietary process.
I am now providing these coatings for pistons and small cylinder heads. The prices given barely cover the costs of the chemicals and materials, but I just want to get recognized for the quality piston coatings that I can provide over the competition. The equipment I am using is very expensive lab surplus equipment and limits the size of part that I can accommodate. If you have an unusual part, please email me with a picture and dimensions so I can give you a quote.
Please call (520)668-5264 after 5pm
I work as an engineer during the day, so please call after 5pm or leave a voicemail or email. Please leave your name, contact information, and the type of coating you are interested in.
Tom Hamilton