Backfire

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speedracer · #21 Post by **speedracer** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 2:11 am

I traced the relay wires to the harness,I think I found them again in the bullet connetors to look for problems in the wiring,none found.It was about 85deg.today,plus humid.I let the quad idle for 15 min.felt the key switch and wires not hot.I am gonna ride it like I stole it,beats shooting 2 foot flames out of the can!It made my dog crap down both legs,as always,thanks for the help guys!

Happyboy · #22 Post by **Happyboy** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:02 am

Tell me this...what could happen if you are wrong?

ozarkdaler · #23 Post by **ozarkdaler** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:13 am

What would make the bike just all of a sudden start that? He never had the issue before nor did I until he put the motor back in.

thedeatons · #24 Post by **thedeatons** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:50 am

The relays are dumb, there is no rhyme or reason as to why a mechanical relay starts to fail. There are moving parts in there, and they fail whenever the tolerances get too loose.

If I am wrong then his keyswitch will melt. If his keyswitch melts from my advice I will help him out by paying for 50% of a new one.... Satisfied? I am that confident with our testing.

ozarkdaler · #25 Post by **ozarkdaler** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:57 am

I guess I have just been lucky then.

thedeatons · #26 Post by **thedeatons** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:13 am

We have had quite a few failures. We once had at lleast 5 fail on the same trip tto Sand Mt. The Dales were sitting in a line idling rough, and we walked downed the line pulling the relays, and each one returned to normal as the relay was pulled. It took us quite a while to figure that out. Usually it happens in cold weather, but not always.

Happyboy · #27 Post by **Happyboy** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:22 am

Deatons taking a hard stance on somehting and declaring it is the word? Wow, thats never happened before.

thedeatons · #28 Post by **thedeatons** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:39 am

Yeah.... well, like I said, I talked to Scooter about it. No one else has. Everyone else likes to speculate about the relay, instead we talked to the guy who invented the circuitry. Then we tested his theory. It was off a bit. No overheat.

Hey, I know! Everyone keep your relays in, then when they run like crap just keep denying that you can remove them and have them run fine. That should fix everything.

It's really annoying when no one pays attention to your suggestion unless your screen name is Canniboomer, Wistech, or Cannondale27.....

Do what you guys want, I don't own Dales anymore, I am just here to try to help now. I could leave pretty easily.....

speedracer · #29 Post by **speedracer** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 12:48 pm

Thanks for the offer James,no need though.At my age I am more likely to overheat before the keyswitch!

cannondale27 · #30 Post by **cannondale27** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 1:13 pm

I am paying attention Deatons.You know I hate those relays as much as you.I never saw 5 fail at one time though.I will say that is impossible.Only 1 has failed on me .Wistech found a real nice sealed relay holder which held our stock relay.This worked great.I also sourced a solidstate relay that worked fine except solid state always leaks a small voltage which is enough to keep the ECU awake=dead battery pulling the fuse or another switch would solve that.The problem with removing the relay is simple.Electrical engineers and even just your basic electricians all know what certain wire guages,diodes and other components are designed to handle amperage wise.Its not only a component issue it can be a true safety issue.I havent researched it but I believe the relay also directly affects the Idle Air Control Stepper motor.Depending on your tune this could be a good or a bad thing.In the case of the 5 failures it was a good thing.In other cases it might be a bad thing that someone may end up fighting a bad idle over if relay is removed.I also worry about the harness itself.I have never really seen a true dissection Of it.Have fixed three quads with failed harnesses after testing and swapping every component harness plugs into including relay but never found the exact source of the failure within the harness.New Harness solved issues.I would like to see someone do a harness layout with pictures of all untaped and bundled.

So thats the concern.That said I do know a few guys running without them for years now.One never even knew it belonged there.Fell out obviously.