"We use more precise measures than just carbon dating now. And yes, it has been proved. It is not 100% accurate but even with a 25% swag in the numbers it still gets you thinking OLD!! Ever heard of physics?
We know what we are looking at."(happyboy)
Carbon dating can't be proved for accuracy for any more than known historical records date back. Can an assumption be based on that, yes. Say it could be perfectly accurate for 10,000 years then lose complete accuracy after another 5000. It can be proven in time, say 10 million years or so, but for now it????????s just really our best possible guess along with a lot of other scientific theories. Physics theories do change, the string theory didn't even exist until a few years ago. Here's something to think about. My six year old wanted a globe for Christmas and he got one. When he was looking at it he said he didn't think that they were right that the continents split apart and drifted. His theory was that the earth was smaller and denser at one time and is expanding outward, which caused the continents to split. His reasoning was, just look at it, and when you do it makes sense .He also said I'll bet water was all air before too, because the earth was probably hotter before and would make all the water evaporate into air. Then he said probably when the earth gets cold the air will become water. He was never taught any of this and came up with this on his own. Needless to say I was very proud of him and he taught me that day, pretty good for a 6 year old. But to get back to the subject these too are just theories good ones, but theories based on what is known. I do believe in science and religion. Always remember just because you are taught something doesn't mean is 100% accurate. We do know what we are looking at but our answers are not always right.
"Just read this.Brings more questions to my mind.Dates are important also.What is stated in regards to Paul.Wow is it true?These people dont deny the existence of Jesus just seem to question the portrayal the Bible gives of him.Does that make me an Atheist also?"(cannondale27)
I can answer this one.No it does not make you an athiest, just as long as you believe in God. Puts you in a category of a different faith thats it.
Atheism????
QUOTE (Smitty911 @ Jan 31 2007, 12:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We don't know how long Adam was alone in the Garden after naming the animals.
We don't know how long Adam and Eve were in the Garden Pre-fall.
We don't know how long Adam and Eve lived before having children.
Homo Sapian has been around how long?? Couple of hundred thousand years, yet we only have a record of langues back around 6,000 years. Traceable to one common langues. We just learned to write, 6,000 years ago.
What did we do for 194,000 years?
We don't know how long Adam and Eve were in the Garden Pre-fall.
We don't know how long Adam and Eve lived before having children.
Homo Sapian has been around how long?? Couple of hundred thousand years, yet we only have a record of langues back around 6,000 years. Traceable to one common langues. We just learned to write, 6,000 years ago.
What did we do for 194,000 years?
What happened to the 1 day of God's time equals 1000 years of our time??
The Bible says that God created everything in 6 days.... now whether or not that is literally 6 days or figuratively meaning 6000 years...... where is the remaining time??
Even if His days are as 10,00 years to us....... where is the remaining time?
One thing about history.....it's written by the winners.
Jimbo
QUOTE (jwheat @ Jan 31 2007, 08:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
What happened to the 1 day of God's time equals 1000 years of our time??
The Bible says that God created everything in 6 days.... now whether or not that is literally 6 days or figuratively meaning 6000 years...... where is the remaining time??
Even if His days are as 10,00 years to us....... where is the remaining time?
One thing about history.....it's written by the winners.
Jimbo
The Bible says that God created everything in 6 days.... now whether or not that is literally 6 days or figuratively meaning 6000 years...... where is the remaining time??
Even if His days are as 10,00 years to us....... where is the remaining time?
One thing about history.....it's written by the winners.
Jimbo
Jwheat,
Everyone I know that isn't a Christian knows that one verse as some kind of argument against Creation. I had already answed is prevously but will so again here.
2Pe 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
2Pe 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as [they were] from the beginning of the creation.
2Pe 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
2Pe 3:6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
2Pe 3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day [is] with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
If you read the whole thing in CONTEXT you will clearly see that this passage is about the Second Coming of Christ. All the bolded verse above means is that God is outside of our time frame.
Mystery Solved. If you have a different explanation for the above in CONTEXT please post it.
What remaining time? you believe that the people who measured the earth age have placed it in the Millions of year range, are they not biased? I look at the same data ask questions, get answers like, "we believe, should, possably, could have, might have, possible, etc etc." These are all guesses. They than follow the statements of faith, with "We know for fact XXXX." Than why all the subjective langue?
Couple of items, We have measured the Moons movement using a laser to measure the distance that the Moon is moving away from the Earth. About 1" per year. OK so extrapalate backwards the Billions of years and what do you know the Moon is so close to the earth that the gravity would have pulled it in. Others have done the math those PhD I worked for, don't hold me to this. I just asked a question the did the calculations.
Good thing that History is written by the winners, I mean who would read a book about a guy whining about getting his butt kicked all the time.
Smitty
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cannondale27
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Smitty I just dont believe that if the Bible is wrong that there is not God.
My point was that I believe $ and Religion have been a issue since begining.Money is the root of all evil is a good saying that I see confirmed all the time.Exodus was slaves.Most would gladly pay rather than enslave if they werent greedy and want easy $ I would think.
I should keep this impersonal but.I think you know fully well what Saint Stephen said when he was in fact killed for Blasphamy.It concerned the Israelites.Why is it that discussions of the role of the Jewish people in the affairs of the world are treaded on so lightly?
My point was that I believe $ and Religion have been a issue since begining.Money is the root of all evil is a good saying that I see confirmed all the time.Exodus was slaves.Most would gladly pay rather than enslave if they werent greedy and want easy $ I would think.
I should keep this impersonal but.I think you know fully well what Saint Stephen said when he was in fact killed for Blasphamy.It concerned the Israelites.Why is it that discussions of the role of the Jewish people in the affairs of the world are treaded on so lightly?
QUOTE (cannondale27 @ Jan 31 2007, 09:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Smitty I just dont believe that if the Bible is wrong that there is not God.
My point was that I believe $ and Religion have been a issue since begining.Money is the root of all evil is a good saying that I see confirmed all the time.Exodus was slaves.Most would gladly pay rather than enslave if they werent greedy and want easy $ I would think.
I should keep this impersonal but.I think you know fully well what Saint Stephen said when he was in fact killed for Blasphamy.It concerned the Israelites.Why is it that discussions of the role of the Jewish people in the affairs of the world are treaded on so lightly?
My point was that I believe $ and Religion have been a issue since begining.Money is the root of all evil is a good saying that I see confirmed all the time.Exodus was slaves.Most would gladly pay rather than enslave if they werent greedy and want easy $ I would think.
I should keep this impersonal but.I think you know fully well what Saint Stephen said when he was in fact killed for Blasphamy.It concerned the Israelites.Why is it that discussions of the role of the Jewish people in the affairs of the world are treaded on so lightly?
'27
I agree with your statement, except I have yet to see where the Bible has been wrong. I have misunderstood it, taken it out of context, had to reasearch the geopolitical history, to get a better understanding of the events, I just haven't seen it be wrong after all additional data is concedered. Still looking though.
Money is not the root of all evil, the saying "The LOVE of money is the root of all evil." Big difference, wouldn't you agree?
The nice thing is we can agree to disagree.
I will have to devote some additional time to Stephen to understand what was going on at that time. I read it a couple of times, but not super closely. I can't answer your last statement, People hate the Jews, why I don't know.
Smitty
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sillysspeed
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cannondale27
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QUOTE (cannondale27 @ Feb 1 2007, 12:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Yes thankyou.Love of $ is root of all evil
Smitty all I know is I attended 8 years of Catholic School and Honestly they taught very little of the Bible regretfully.Now as a adult I try to read or pay attention to what the Bible says and I do question much of it.
Smitty all I know is I attended 8 years of Catholic School and Honestly they taught very little of the Bible regretfully.Now as a adult I try to read or pay attention to what the Bible says and I do question much of it.
'27,
See we can actually agree about the money thing.
It has been my experience that Catholics don't read the Bible and therefore alot of misunderstanding is spread. The guy next to me is Catholic and I asked him a quick question about Stephen and he said "Who."
My hope and pray is that before people throw out the idea of a God, they actually read the Bible and other sources and do some research. You don't have to turn off your Brain to believe in God. I don't think I have anyway. But I've been wrong before.
Smitty
QUOTE (Smitty911 @ Jan 31 2007, 03:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Good thing that History is written by the winners, I mean who would read a book about a guy whining about getting his butt kicked all the time.
Smitty
Smitty
LOL Good answer.
I've been thinking about this today and my next question concerns Adam and Eve being the first humans and the progenitors of the human race. How did everyone escape the problems of inbreeding? Why are we not all mentally handicapped, missing a limb, or have ears like Prince Charles? Plus after a few generations of inbreeding, you would most likely produce sterile offspring and that would be the end.
This question also applies to the animals that Moses gathered and placed in the ark.
Since any type of radiation degredation dating is questionable in your opinion, what would you say if the Shroud of Turin or the Spear of Destiny were carbon-dated and found to be exactly as old as the Bible claims? Would the carbon-dating be suspect then? To me, it's like shooting a bullet out of a gun along a parallel line with the ground...... we know how fast the bullet travels and we know how much force gravity will apply to it , so we can figure where it will eventually strike the ground within a reasonable distance. That is the key word. The Bible or anything else we have so far encountered tells of any unreasonable or extraordinary force that might have changed the degredation time of radioactive isotopes beyond what has been recorded. Science allows a fairly wide margin of error in these calculations and any change outside of that margin would have to be extraordinary.
The Bible states for a fact that several miracles have happened in a grandiose scale....... what miracles (in your opinion) to match that scale have happened in the last couple of hundred years?
Just so you will know for future reference in this conversation, I was baptised as a baby and again as an adult and raised in the Methodist church from birth till present (or almost present). I have tithed as much as anyone I personally know and have kept up all of the vehicles(buses & vans) at my church for several years for free (I own a mechanic shop). 28 months ago my oldest son (18 at the time) was in a car wreck and spent two days in a coma before he died. I have not attended church, participated in church activites, or donated to a church since the funeral. While I have always considered myself a Christian, my beliefs are currently strongly challenged.
Jimbo
By the way.... your making me strain my small brain!!
QUOTE (jwheat @ Jan 31 2007, 07:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I've been thinking about this today and my next question concerns Adam and Eve being the first humans and the progenitors of the human race. How did everyone escape the problems of inbreeding? Why are we not all mentally handicapped, missing a limb, or have ears like Prince Charles? Plus after a few generations of inbreeding, you would most likely produce sterile offspring and that would be the end.
This question also applies to the animals that Moses gathered and placed in the ark.
This question also applies to the animals that Moses gathered and placed in the ark.
That's one thing I've always questioned and have never been given a reason except for "god wouldn't allow those problems at the start of creation". Would like to hear an answer from somebody who's quite versed in their faith.